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Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby RayMac1963 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:29 pm

You're right, and sadly neither will banning guns. How many people did Timothy Mcveigh with diesel fuel and fertilizer and no gun? If someone has the will, they will find a way.

If they want to make the gauntlet to get a gun difficult fine. Put all the background and mental health checks in place you want. Good honest gun owners will abide by them. Heck i took a 25 question test this morning to get another handgun purchase permit. The officer at the counter knows me well enough that she didn't even give me the booklet to study. She handed me the test and smiled, grabbed my file and went to type out the form. But there were three other people sitting there waiting on fed clearances and fingerprint searches to come back. And as a good gun owner, i can say i was GLAD to see the system work. That wait makes me safer, but it doesn't infringe on my right to own.
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby daaswampman » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:47 pm

You are on one very slippery slope when you try to define Mental Illness. Some are no questions asked, but most are something else. Should we call every person that has lost their temper - mentally ill? Well there goes 95% of men. Then who else should we go after - women that have had depression or maybe just the blues. How about the millions that go to the Doctor for every tiny thing while their real problem is insecurity and lack of attention - there goes 90% of old people.

Treating mental illness is expensive, not well defined, and is largely ineffective as it is not a cure. Give then some therapy, give them some drugs and wait for the next episode. Swamp
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby readytogo1955 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:27 pm

Ok,so is the Gov fault that my weapons are not lockup and I know that I’m living with a relative that is not mentally stable, I also don`t know what my siblings are doing or hanging around with ,in the old days I would have been call a irresponsible parent, also we live in a open society ,free, we have rights, but we also have responsibilities ,and as weapons owners, we have to know where they are 24/7,we have laws that say so, even if your weapon is stolen and you fail to report it, you may be negligible for the crime committed, on the issue of mental health, well lets lock them all up. :evil:
http://www.cdc.gov/mentalhealthsurveillance/
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby USAFESP20th » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:01 pm

daaswampman wrote:You are on one very slippery slope when you try to define Mental Illness. Some are no questions asked, but most are something else. Should we call every person that has lost their temper - mentally ill? Well there goes 95% of men. Then who else should we go after - women that have had depression or maybe just the blues. How about the millions that go to the Doctor for every tiny thing while their real problem is insecurity and lack of attention - there goes 90% of old people.

Treating mental illness is expensive, not well defined, and is largely ineffective as it is not a cure. Give then some therapy, give them some drugs and wait for the next episode. Swamp


As a Law Enforcement Officer, I saw what the Mentally Ill can do within a crime scene, these crimes make crimes of passion look like Disney Movie?
DON"T TREAD ON ME!!!! Live Free and Proud, Always!!!!!!

O' Great Spirit, help me always to speak the truth quietly, to listen with an open mind when others speak, and to remember the peace that may be found in Silence! " Cherokee Prayer"
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby USAFESP20th » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:05 pm

readytogo1955 wrote:Ok,so is the Gov fault that my weapons are not lockup and I know that I’m living with a relative that is not mentally stable, I also don`t know what my siblings are doing or hanging around with ,in the old days I would have been call a irresponsible parent, also we live in a open society ,free, we have rights, but we also have responsibilities ,and as weapons owners, we have to know where they are 24/7,we have laws that say so, even if your weapon is stolen and you fail to report it, you may be negligible for the crime committed, on the issue of mental health, well lets lock them all up. :evil:
http://www.cdc.gov/mentalhealthsurveillance/


Think of what you wrote and you'll answer your own question, Rights are Responsibilities of one's own actions?
DON"T TREAD ON ME!!!! Live Free and Proud, Always!!!!!!

O' Great Spirit, help me always to speak the truth quietly, to listen with an open mind when others speak, and to remember the peace that may be found in Silence! " Cherokee Prayer"
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby USAFESP20th » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:15 pm

BE ADVISED, YOU PEOPLE LISTEN, Mental Illness in this country is never BEEN treated correctly by Doctors or Gov't Officials by Sponsoring Mental Health Regulations and was never place in the Firearms Background Check by then Senator now Vice President Joe Biden Whom wrote the Brady Firearms Bill Gun Purchase Background Checks for President Clinton, Biden's Forked Up, A DEMOCRATIC SPONSORED AND WRITTEN BILL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CAN YOU DIG IT? Please educate yourselves by researching the Gun Laws and Mental Health Regulations, it's there, in black and white PRINT??????????????????? :smartass: Also trying to get the states to agree with a set of regulations on mental health issues related to violent persons pertaining to gun background checks to reciprocate to each other is like adding breast to a bull, just does't work????? CAN YOU DIG IT NOW :smartass: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HENCE THE TITLE????????? :help: We need better reciprocating Mental Health Laws throughout the United States Governing mental health patients who do need to purchase a firearm, but at what cost to the people of America, our 2nd Amendment, Hopefully not our freedom?????????? :gunsmile:
DON"T TREAD ON ME!!!! Live Free and Proud, Always!!!!!!

O' Great Spirit, help me always to speak the truth quietly, to listen with an open mind when others speak, and to remember the peace that may be found in Silence! " Cherokee Prayer"
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby daaswampman » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:25 pm

America is so worried about discrimination and the American With Disabilities Act, that they refuse to publicly admit, that many mentally ill people can be very dangerous. We see it all the time in the ER when they get off their medications or simply misunderstand something. Swamp
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby RayMac1963 » Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:07 am

readytogo1955 wrote:Ok,so is the Gov fault that my weapons are not lockup and I know that I’m living with a relative that is not mentally stable,


Didn't they report today that they found out his mother had been trying to get him committed? Now, i'm not kicking dirt on the dead, but she should have better secured her weapons if she knew he was depressed or had a mental problem.

I have some friends and family coming over during the holidays and drinks will flow, there will also be some guest children around, and i know i cant keep eyes on everyone and everything. Guess what? Tomorrow I'm clearing my house of my "stash guns" and knifes and securing them all and locking up my ammo.

As someone said, "personal responsibly".
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby mintbird » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:57 am

Exactly, RayMac! :thumbsup:
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby RayMac1963 » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:21 am

Thanks Mint.

OK, so my wife brings up this very subject this morning. As I mentioned she is a clinical therapist. So she says she has a client who has a 11 year old with depression and anger issues, Guess what? The lady keep ALL the cooking knives and sharps in a tuperware container LOCKED in her trunk when she isn't cooking. and obviously she has the child in counselling... now THATS "personal responsibly".
"Laugh all you want, but when the zombies come we both know who's house you'll be running to for protection" - TheYankeeMarshal



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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby beachbrratt » Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:11 am

daaswampman wrote:You are on one very slippery slope when you try to define Mental Illness. Some are no questions asked, but most are something else. Should we call every person that has lost their temper - mentally ill? Well there goes 95% of men. Then who else should we go after - women that have had depression or maybe just the blues. How about the millions that go to the Doctor for every tiny thing while their real problem is insecurity and lack of attention - there goes 90% of old people.

Treating mental illness is expensive, not well defined, and is largely ineffective as it is not a cure. Give then some therapy, give them some drugs and wait for the next episode. Swamp



You are right on the mark. Let anyone sit down with a Psych. doctor and they could diagnose each and every one of us with a problem. OCD is even a problem and as quoted the list goes on and on. So just because people get depressed doesn't make them a killer. They need to look at a persons history and their actions in the past. If there's a pattern, then yes something should be done. But get your facts straight before you go on a witch hunt. Most people who suffer severe depression, sleep and sleep and sleep some more. Don't see them as much of a threat.
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby USAFESP20th » Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:38 am

beachbrratt wrote:
daaswampman wrote:You are on one very slippery slope when you try to define Mental Illness. Some are no questions asked, but most are something else. Should we call every person that has lost their temper - mentally ill? Well there goes 95% of men. Then who else should we go after - women that have had depression or maybe just the blues. How about the millions that go to the Doctor for every tiny thing while their real problem is insecurity and lack of attention - there goes 90% of old people.

Treating mental illness is expensive, not well defined, and is largely ineffective as it is not a cure. Give then some therapy, give them some drugs and wait for the next episode. Swamp



You are right on the mark. Let anyone sit down with a Psych. doctor and they could diagnose each and every one of us with a problem. OCD is even a problem and as quoted the list goes on and on. So just because people get depressed doesn't make them a killer. They need to look at a persons history and their actions in the past. If there's a pattern, then yes something should be done. But get your facts straight before you go on a witch hunt. Most people who suffer severe depression, sleep and sleep and sleep some more. Don't see them as much of a threat.


Don't see them as a Threat, Mental Illness is a SILENT THREAT, how many more people has to be killed by a loved one who has mental illness, not just by firearms, try a claw hammer used by drywallers like in Georgia when a father with severe depression killed his entire family!! I guess ignore the mental illness is the american way of life, Wow!!!!! :thumbsup: They don't when the feds take your rights away, Third World States do not have Rights remember that!
DON"T TREAD ON ME!!!! Live Free and Proud, Always!!!!!!

O' Great Spirit, help me always to speak the truth quietly, to listen with an open mind when others speak, and to remember the peace that may be found in Silence! " Cherokee Prayer"
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby beachbrratt » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:00 pm

A long article but well worth reading http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... lness.html
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby USAFESP20th » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:59 pm

beachbrratt wrote:A long article but well worth reading http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... lness.html


Green River Killer ( Mentally Ill )
Ted Bundy ( Mentally Ill )
Adolf Hitler 1934 -1944 over 16 million jews ( Mentally Ill )
BTK killer ( Mentally Ill )
Cop Killers ( Mentally Ill )
Osama Bin Laden ( Educated Mentally Ill )
Saddam Hussein ( Mentally Ill )
Japanese terrorist who use sarin gas in Tokyo subway system ( Mentally Ill )
Charles Manson ( Mentally Ill not paroled )
All American serial killers ( Mentally Ill )
Jack the Ripper ( Mason Mentally Ill )
Jeffery Dahamer serial killer who ate victims ( ah! Mentally Ill )
Lots more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DON"T TREAD ON ME!!!! Live Free and Proud, Always!!!!!!

O' Great Spirit, help me always to speak the truth quietly, to listen with an open mind when others speak, and to remember the peace that may be found in Silence! " Cherokee Prayer"
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Re: Mentally Ill and Firearms, Obama's Fault OR Americas?

Postby beachbrratt » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:59 am

USAFESP20th wrote:
beachbrratt wrote:A long article but well worth reading http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... lness.html


Green River Killer ( Mentally Ill )
Ted Bundy ( Mentally Ill )
Adolf Hitler 1934 -1944 over 16 million jews ( Mentally Ill )
BTK killer ( Mentally Ill )
Cop Killers ( Mentally Ill )
Osama Bin Laden ( Educated Mentally Ill )
Saddam Hussein ( Mentally Ill )
Japanese terrorist who use sarin gas in Tokyo subway system ( Mentally Ill )
Charles Manson ( Mentally Ill not paroled )
All American serial killers ( Mentally Ill )
Jack the Ripper ( Mason Mentally Ill )
Jeffery Dahamer serial killer who ate victims ( ah! Mentally Ill )
Lots more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Let's not forget that if anyone kills someone wether in self defense or accidentally, society will dictate wether you were mentally ill (prepper, cache of guns and years of food) this is the stigma of being a prepper (paranoid, delusional)
1. having false or unrealistic beliefs or opinions: Senators who think they will get agreement on a comprehensive tax bill are delusional.
2. Psychiatry. maintaining fixed false beliefs even when confronted with facts, usually as a result of mental illness: He was so delusional and paranoid that he thought everybody was conspiring against him.
That's how people see preppers, like it or not. Society hates what they don't understand and therefore condemn it. Be careful how far you push the envelope, just saying...
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