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Are CB radios still an option?

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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby TRex2 » Wed Aug 10, 2016 4:35 pm

Since I will be operating in an uncongested area, I wouldn't need to fix them up.
Just use them as is. I might look into them.

After I get my allowance, LoL
Calling Islam a religion isn't much different than calling Nazism or Communism a religion.
Both were also political movements with a religious component, just like Islam.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby straightshooter » Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:47 am

I think CBs are an excellent option - as a PART of a person's comms preps. I'm just getting started in this area. Last night at work I was just bs-ing with a co-worker and remarked about the rather large antenna on his vehicle, I assumed it was for HAM and he corrected me that it was for CB. After a short discussion about atmospherics, peaking, tweaking and a bunch of stuff I don't understand he says that he goes up on a hill outside of town and can talk with people on BOTH coasts. NO SHIDooDLE! Back in his office he pulls up conversations from the internet to back up his story. Yeah he's peaked and tuned his SSB equipment, got a not-so-subtle antenna and "might" have amped his output but even at low power he's talking a long ways in certain conditions.
To make a long story shorter, he had a peaked and tuned radio he bought online and decided he could part with for a Grant FR note. It's a steal in my book, and going home with me in the morning. Whoopie! Another project for October '16!
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby TRex2 » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:39 am

True: CB is an excellent option. But only under very certain circumstances should you consider it a primary communications piece. I used to do CB/SSB back in the 70's, so I know all about what he is talking about, but for the prepper, reliability of their comms is the priority.

Sure, I could talk cross country if the conditions were right, but the important thing was that I could talk to someone a dozen miles away, every single day. Congratulations on what seems to be a good purchase, and I hope you do well with it.

(You're in or near the mountains... wonder how a CB/SSB rig with an NVIS antenna would work...)
Calling Islam a religion isn't much different than calling Nazism or Communism a religion.
Both were also political movements with a religious component, just like Islam.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Defcon09 » Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:19 pm

Affirmative here also. SSB would be best but regular AM is far more popular and would make an excellent form of comms with a group on the road or at the BOL.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Roaddogg » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:28 pm

With all of the options that was stated before... In a SHTF situation, with a CB radio, you can at least listen to the truckers on channel 19 as to where they are delivering supplies...What roads are opened / closed and so on.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Defcon09 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:51 pm

Yes it is.




Roaddogg wrote:With all of the options that was stated before... In a SHTF situation, with a CB radio, you can at least listen to the truckers on channel 19 as to where they are delivering supplies...What roads are opened / closed and so on.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby orangetom1999 » Fri Jun 30, 2017 10:57 am

A suggestion , If I might.....

A peaked and tuned radio is fine...for sure.


However...there might come conditions in a SHTF situation where you do not want to leave a peaked and tuned fingerprint...or running so much power that you stand out all across the country or country.

With this in mind it is often nice and convenient to have a variable resistor installed in line by which you can adjust your out put power up or down as needed. This no matter how powerful your final transistor puts out the watts. In this manner it us up to you as to how big a fingerprint your rig leaves in the airwaves.

This is common on most HF Ham radios and I have seen CB'ers who have incorporated this feature into the backs of their rigs.

You might not want everyone to know you are there by leaving a huge amount of power...a huge fingerprint ...to let everyone know you are there.

For those of you who know how...a directional antenna and adjustable power are optimal....and for those who know even more....the ground plane of your vehicle and how to use it to your best advantage helps as well...with adjustable output power. In otherwords the transmitting pattern of your mobile set up..how and in what direction your mobile antenna transmits the best.

This no matter what bands on which one operates.


Just a passing thought.

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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby WillProspector » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:33 pm

Punisher1336 wrote:CB is very limited. But using it to monitor the emergency channel 9 is something to consider. But CB would be low on my priority list. Initially I started with GRMS, quickly evolved to HAM using Bao Fengs, which I consider glorified CBs. Just upgraded to Yaesu 857d and have a lot of antenna options to acquire before I consider picking up a CB which I don't see integrating in my comms plan.


I suggest everyone reads this article: http://www.itstactical.com/digicom/comm ... unication/

"License free, low cost, two-way communication. What’s not to love about MURS? MURS stands for Multi User Radio Service, and is one of the best kept secrets in personal and family radio communications.

Formerly available only for business communications, the FCC has kept five MURS frequencies license-free and open for public use since 2000. Handheld radios broadcasting on MURS frequencies can experience a range of two miles to eight miles depending on terrain and obstructions, while MURS Base Stations can reach up to 20 miles.

The stipulations for MURS use provided by the FCC restrict any transmitter in excess of two watts, but any type of antenna is allowed as long as the tower height (with antenna) is no greater than 60 feet high. All communications must also yield to any emergency communication on the same channel.
Frequencies

The five MURS frequencies are listed below, The 154 MHz channels can be operated on the standard 25 kHz wide band or narrow band mode. The 151 MHz channels can only be operated in narrow band mode.

151.820 MHz
151.880 MHz
151.940 MHz
154.570 MHz
154.600 MHz

Each of the five frequencies can not only transmit voice, but also data. The best example of this are the driveway alarms which transmit a signal via MURS when the IR sensor is tripped.
Can you hear me now?

Another hidden benefit of MURS frequencies are the PL codes (Private Line codes) or CTCSS (Continuous Tone Coded Squelch System) which are sub-audible tones that allow users to operate on the same channel without hearing chatter directed to other users.

There are 38 PL codes available to each of the five MURS frequencies, which makes for a combination of 190 different MURS channels. While this is not encryption, anyone not operating with the same PL code won’t hear your conversation.
How MURS stacks up

Most everyone has seen the small hand-held walkie-talkies that operate on the FRS (Family Radio Service), the best example of this are the small Motorola Talkabout Radios marketed towards family communication.

Here are some great comparisons courtesy of PRSG.

Compared with FRS (Family Radio Service) at 460 MHz:

MURS (at 150 MHz) permits four times more power (2 Watts TPO instead the 0.500 Watts ERP limit for FRS).
At MURS frequencies, signals bend over hills better, but FRS signals are better at bouncing off of surfaces and penetrating into/escaping out of buildings.
You may connect a MURS radio to an external or exterior antenna. FRS radios must employ a non-detachable antenna. For vehicle-to-vehicle operation with external (roof-mount) antennas, MURS should provide three to ten (or more) times the range possible with FRS radios.

Compared with GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) at 460 MHz:

GMRS handheld radios have typically two to five watts transmitter power. GMRS vehicular units transmit typically with ten to 50 watts. There is no limit on the ERP of GMRS stations operating on the primary channels. GMRS stations may transmit with no more the 5 Watts ERP on the seven “interstitial” frequencies (those shared with the FRS).
GMRS operation requires an FCC license.
At MURS frequencies, signals bend over hills better, but GMRS signals are better at bouncing off of surfaces and penetrating into/escaping out of buildings.
For vehicle-to-vehicle operation with external (roof-mount) antennas, MURS should provide one-and-a-half to four times the range possible with GMRS handheld radios also connected to roof-mount antennas. Depending on the surrounding terrain, MURS units connected to roof-mounted antennas might even outperform full-power (50 watt) GMRS mobile units, although the GMRS units should have a greater range in open terrain.
Many GMRS radios can communicate through repeater stations for extended range (typically up to twenty miles or more, sometimes much more). The new FCC Rules will prohibit repeaters in MURS.

Compared with CB (Citizens Band Radio) at 27 MHz:

CB radios may transmit with more power than MURS units may, but communications range is highly dependent on channel congestion and atmospheric conditions. CB communications can also be significantly degraded by noise from vehicle ignition systems and from other man-made sources.
CB signals bend over hills and around obstacles much better than MURS (at 150 MHz) or FRS/GMRS (at 460 MHz) signals.
Vehicle-to-vehicle MURS communications will probably be comparable and possibly quite superior to that available in the CB service.
MURS communications will not suffer from the kind of long-range “skip” interference frequently encountered on CB radio at 27 MHz.

Keep in mind on all these comparisons that MURS has it’s benefits, but GMRS requires an FCC license to operate on.
Where to buy?

MURS radios can now be commonly found online at retailers such as Amazon.com and are starting to increase in popularity as more people find out what they’re missing. The great thing about MURS frequencies is that they can be programmed (with or without PL codes) into existing radios which can be a backup to licensed communication. A dedicated MURS radio also makes a good backup radio if your primary means of communication go down."
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby orangetom1999 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:18 am

Very interesting post WillProspector,

I have never used these frequencies...for which you have listed here in the MURS band.

151.820 MHz
151.880 MHz
151.940 MHz
154.570 MHz
154.600 MHz


I did, however, plug these frequencies into my Baofeng BF F8HP walkie talkie and they work fine as I cross checked between two of the BF F8P radios. Both of them transmit and receive fine on these frequencies.

What I have done is to program the FRS/GMRS frequencies from storage space 106 to 127 with these GMRS/FRS frequencies.

I am now considering also manually programming into these five MURS frequencies From 100 to 105 storage space/channel.

The limitation of these rigs is that they are FM line of sight transmission. The VHF bands will occasionally go long or "skip/DX" as the term is used..but not for very long and it is not a good thing to count on this for help.

I personally like VHF frequencies and often hook up with my friend across the river wherein we switch to the lower end of the 2 meter ham band to work SSB modes.

But these Baofeng radios put out a bit more power than does the MURS type radios. I do not concern myself about that as Mostly I monitor the FRS/GMRS frequencies and soon the MURS Frequencies as well.

You have me thinking also about putting these frequencies into my VHF/UHF rig which is a Wouxan UV920 p radio.

https://www.amazon.com/Wouxun-KG-UV920P ... Fvhf+radio

I ve not used this radio in some time now ..opting instead for using my Icom 706 MK II and also my Yaesu FT 890.

Both this Icom and Yaesu radio have been modified to transmit straight through all the bands including the CB bands. I particularly wanted the CB bands accessable in all the modes available on these radios.


But I have never considered the MURS bands ...but now that you have provided the frequencies I will program them accordingly. Mostly I will monitor them as do I also on the GMRS/FRS frequencies. Here locally the GMRS frequencies seem want to be used by the schools and also some Hotels and olde folks homes.

I have built my own J pole antennas to use on the VHF/UHF frequencies and they work fine. Also I have the adapters for these walkie talkies that I can hook them up to a dual band magnetic base mobile antenna in my cars, truck, and van. This works out fine verses a full sized VHF/UHF Mobile radio.


Nonetheless ...thanks for the frequencies. I did not know that information's prior to your post.



A very 73 to you and your house,

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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Vetmike » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:01 am

All well and good but remember that anything you transmit can be picked up by anybody with the right equipment. There was entity called the Army Security Agency and it had the capability to listen in on any sort of electronic emission as well as DFing it. Per FCC regulations, it is illegal for you to encode or otherwise conceal your message so using something like PGP or any other cryptography is illegal. It is also illegal to use brevity codes (eg 6256 means 'met at Sam's Place')
The safest way to use any form of communication is to always act as if someone was listening to your every word. So don't broadcast: "Joe, you and your convoy meet us at the intersection of Highways 90 and 15 and we'll go on to the bug out site." cause someone with illintent will be waiting for you.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby orangetom1999 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:30 am

Vetmike wrote:All well and good but remember that anything you transmit can be picked up by anybody with the right equipment. There was entity called the Army Security Agency and it had the capability to listen in on any sort of electronic emission as well as DFing it. Per FCC regulations, it is illegal for you to encode or otherwise conceal your message so using something like PGP or any other cryptography is illegal. It is also illegal to use brevity codes (eg 6256 means 'met at Sam's Place')
The safest way to use any form of communication is to always act as if someone was listening to your every word. So don't broadcast: "Joe, you and your convoy meet us at the intersection of Highways 90 and 15 and we'll go on to the bug out site." cause someone with illintent will be waiting for you.



I am going to call BS on this one VetMike.... not out of disrespect but with great respect.


I so state because for those who know ...there applies a certain amount of "OPSEC" on many things we do and in which we are interested in as preppers.

How much OPSEC is up to the individuals themselves.

There is another aspect to Preppers and thinkers which is not often spoken about ...and that is that Preppers as a whole do not like or want to be
"herded" in with the rest of the two legged wildlife....in anything to do with prepping or SHTF...TEOTWAWKI. We will make up our own mind and conduct ourselves accordingly.

Now governments...and what I call...government "whoredom" is exactly the opposite. Governments tend towards constantly "Herding" people while they themselves work to a different tune and standard. History is replete with this evidence and or tale. One size fits all...except for them...government.
This is done by constantly "Herding People." Crisis management...dissonance...manufacturing a bad guy on which to focus publically manufactured wrath. Fear and insecurity techniques through whoring out the media to control peoples fears and insecurities.

We are talking here in the extreme about survival..not necessarily legal or illegal.

I know sufficient to understand certain aspects of government as "whoredom" ..institutional whoredom in good times or bad. The real read of history indicates that government will barter, sell, or trade anyone's soul to keep and maintain power and control....full scale insecurity.

We have been told by our founders never to trust government...by binding them with the Chains of the Constitution.


In a SHTF or TEEOTWAWKI...all that legal and illegal stuff goes right out the window. True enough about being monitored or DF'd. I understand that.


I just wanted to put a certain perspective on that..with respect to your position about being monitored and DF'd.


I have been told by certain Olde Timers ..that the safest manner of secure communications is a light and morse code...at night. However that has severe line of sight limitations. But radio..yes...it can be monitored.

We have experimented here with home made horizontal directional antennas...for covering long distances using horizontal polarity and it works well but is not entirely monitor proof.


Thanks,
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Defcon09 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:18 pm

orangetom1999 wrote:
Vetmike wrote:All well and good but remember that anything you transmit can be picked up by anybody with the right equipment. There was entity called the Army Security Agency and it had the capability to listen in on any sort of electronic emission as well as DFing it. Per FCC regulations, it is illegal for you to encode or otherwise conceal your message so using something like PGP or any other cryptography is illegal. It is also illegal to use brevity codes (eg 6256 means 'met at Sam's Place')
The safest way to use any form of communication is to always act as if someone was listening to your every word. So don't broadcast: "Joe, you and your convoy meet us at the intersection of Highways 90 and 15 and we'll go on to the bug out site." cause someone with illintent will be waiting for you.



I am going to call BS on this one VetMike.... not out of disrespect but with great respect.


.........................In a SHTF or TEEOTWAWKI...all that legal and illegal stuff goes right out the window. True enough about being monitored or DF'd. I understand that.


I have to agree with you also OT on this one. In a event the Feds/GOV, etc. will be falling all over themselves when it hits. Weak signal comms will be put on the back burner and as for the evil do'ers listening, we have ways of confusing them. Anyways, for us who should prepare before it hits, get the gang together and develope your own "smoke signals", if ya know what I mean.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby daaswampman » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:18 pm

CB is the only system that has ever "actually" helped me in the read world! Out in the middle of nothing and was heard on a scanner. He called for help and I always wished I could have said thank you. Snake bites have a way of changing your priorities! Swamp
People rarely notice what it right in front of their eyes. The Da Vinci Code
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby Vetmike » Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:16 am

Orangetom. I understand what you are saying and in a grid down or TEOTWAWKI event all the rules are off. My point, which I guess I didn't make very well, is that, firstly, the Feds have the capability of intercepting and DF'ing every form of electronic communication and, in an insurgency environment, they will use those capabilities and it could spell disaster for the unprepared. Secondly, one should always act as though every word you are broadcasting is being monitored, if not by the Feds then by folks who may wish you harm. Having a set of brevity codes or even developing your own one time pads is good but don't use them on air. That just runs up the red flag. And, if by chance the FCC hears you (they have monitor stations all over, one about fifty miles from me) they will come looking for you.
And if you really want to go Secret Squirrel I have lots more I could teach you.
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Re: Are CB radios still an option?

Postby orangetom1999 » Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:21 pm

Vetmike wrote:Orangetom. I understand what you are saying and in a grid down or TEOTWAWKI event all the rules are off. My point, which I guess I didn't make very well, is that, firstly, the Feds have the capability of intercepting and DF'ing every form of electronic communication and, in an insurgency environment, they will use those capabilities and it could spell disaster for the unprepared. Secondly, one should always act as though every word you are broadcasting is being monitored, if not by the Feds then by folks who may wish you harm. Having a set of brevity codes or even developing your own one time pads is good but don't use them on air. That just runs up the red flag. And, if by chance the FCC hears you (they have monitor stations all over, one about fifty miles from me) they will come looking for you.
And if you really want to go Secret Squirrel I have lots more I could teach you.


Thanks Mike and I agree about the Capabilities of the Feds.

I have been wondering to myself about these new generation of cell phone towers. Instincts tell me they can monitor more than just cell phones and by design.
They are certainly long or tall enough to handle multi band antennas and I have built my own long wires as well as VHF/UHF antennas.


I have seen the antenna arrays on the sail structures of Submarines ..even installed some of these telescoping masts as well as the floating wire antenna arrays .the long wave stuff as well as the shorter wavelengths..inside the radio rooms too before they put in the cypher locks.

And some of this gear has been today replaced by more sophisticated gear.

You become aware that they can record everything and anything and if necessary send it off to somewhere where it can be broken down by people with more specialized gear.

Oh..by the way...your comment about an insurgency environment...
As I recall the events early in the Afghanistan War....against the Taliban and or Al Queda....it became an instant death sentence for them to use a walkie talkie or a cell phone...particularly in the mountainous areas where they were want to flee. That told me a lot about rapid response capabilities in the communications arena.
That should be sufficient warning to preppers and radio operational security...Opsec.

This is one reason I don't have a cell phone wherein I cannot remove the battery at my discretion..and also why I carry spare cell phone batteries.
I see to many people with these new fangled phones wherein you cannot change the battery but must have a charger. Astonishing to me.

If you look at and examine the portion of your cell phone...under settings....or system serial numbers.. This can lead to the type of programming In your cell phone...cell phone type...etc etc et al.

If one has your cell phone number this is even easier. But if not looking for certain cell phone programming is the route to go.

What I am talking about here is a type of cell phone IFF interrogator program to identify your cell phone in a huge field of cell phones..world wide...either by phone number or failing that ,...the system serial numbers by types....what phone is allotted to you and the computer programming type which will govern designed built in remote access.

Nonetheless ..my instincts tell me that your cell phone can be interrogated from afar...from around the world if the links can be established..thus giving up your location. Even if you are not using the phone...it can be interrogated to give up certain information's and identify itself. You see!!??
This is why you need to be able to remove the battery...at your discretion...and why I won't have a phone wherein the battery cannot be easily removed.

I've seen IFF gear when I was in the Air Force..and have some idea how it works. Some of the IFF gear has special slots for special function cards to be installed for special purposes.

I've also seen the IFF gear on 688 class Submarines.

Just something which came to me one day...the idea that your cell phone can be interrogated from afar without you being aware of it...and thus your location given up. Today we would call this "Hacking."
It can be so done to computers..and a cell phone is just a digital radio controlled phone/computer.

Most of us have never been around equipment like this and thus..we are not want to think it through. But I have seen enough of this gear over the years.
And also I think some of these cell phone towers are multiband antenna arrays...in addition to cell phone services.


Be Warned.


Thanks for your posts,

My .02,
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