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Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby Mollypup » Sat Feb 04, 2017 7:56 pm

RayMac1963 wrote:
DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE wrote:He was elected on this promise BY THE PEOPLE....There is nothing wrong with him fulfilling his promises that he was elected for.


Don't forget half the eligible voter did not vote, and he actually lost the popular vote by the largest of and electoral collage/popular vote flip. It easy for us to get bound up in our own little political world and brush these folks off as snowflakes, tree huggers, feminazies and such. We have to live with these people as one nation. Right now it pretty much getting pulled into 2. Mainly because were screaming so loud we can't hear each other. Neither side is right, or perfect. We better settle or beef and get our united act together before someone comes along and eats our lunch for us.


Exactly Ray. Not to mention both sides are being manipulated & pitted against each other, have been for nearly a decade. Deliberately. (anyone who doesn't believe that, I've got a bridge for sale, cheap)

A few have shaken out of it and stepped back & are beginning to see what's going on more clearly. But not nearly enough. Nor do I think it will ever be enough. The MSM & social media keeps the masses on both sides charged up and emotionally volatile. Why? Because it's truly hard to think in that frame of mind. And the last thing either party wants is for the american people to think for themselves. I would imagine that for whomever is orchestrating this scenario, it would be catastrophic to have the public start thinking for themselves. So they will keep tossing gas on the flames.

I've got friends, both liberal & conservative, good people normally........who are currently acting so far out of character that I just stare at them like :blink: wtf has possessed you? These are normally intelligent reasonable people, who while they might disagree at times, still got along just fine. This crud is also tearing families apart. It's like we're coming apart at the seams & everyone is just too tied up in their own emotions (and what they want) to see what's happening around them.

Given the state of the nation over the past 8 yrs under Obama and the escalation of that effect with the election & inauguration of Trump I would like people to stop and think just what state this nation will be in 4 years time or god forbid 8 yrs.

Because if you think the liberals or the MSM are going to back off, then you need a reality check. They will do everything they can possibly think of to block any move Trump makes. It doesn't matter if they succeed, it's the very behavior itself that is destructive. Hell, the very attitude is destructive. In 4 or 8 yrs if a democrat gets voted in, conservatives will react in kind, because if for no other reason, it has become the status quo. President will be an empty title because anything the person holding that title attempts to do (no matter how good) will be met with vehement obstruction. As for congress, we've already seen the results of such behavior on them when they allowed Obamacare to pass without even knowing what its contents were.

Any country with an ineffective govt is dead.

I'm so sick & tired of hearing people say "well conservatives did it" or "liberals did it" as their excuse for childish disrespectful behavior. You don't have to sink to someone's immature poor behavior to make a stand for what you feel is right. To do so, no matter how justified it may feel, just assures no one you're trying to convince will listen to your message. The right road is usually the hardest to travel, it doesn't mean that it's not worth it in the end.

If the public doesn't start wising up soon, they're not going to have to worry about any of these issues. There will be a new govt in town and I'm certain they're not going to give a crap what the public thinks of feels.

I can envision what would happen with a major attack on the US right now. (not ISIS, but an actual act of war via another country) By the time everyone stopped blaming each other and bickering about the right course of action, the conquering troops would be banging on your door. :glare: You would most certainly NOT see the normal psychological unification effect that was seen on 9/11.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby daaswampman » Sat Feb 04, 2017 9:34 pm

You could argue the number of votes, but what differences does it make now? It is also just silly to think, that everyone who didn't vote would have voted for Clinton. I know people who did not vote, because they did not believe he could win. A fact that the media constantly reported.

Trump was elected, because someone with real power wanted him elected. What we should all be wondering is why! My gut feeling, loosing the election was a better option than letting their candidate Hillary win. They may have made a mistake and he may actually do a decent job - if he is allowed to. Let us have one major terrorist attack and he will go from villain to hero in about one second flat over the ban!

The worse scenario and probably the right one, we are going into depression and no insider wants to be in charge when that happens (except Hillary Clinton who is too damn old to ever run again). The worst part, the quickest way to recover from depression is WAR. Now - who do you think is most likely to get us into a WAR. Swamp
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE » Sat Feb 04, 2017 10:31 pm

anita wrote:
RayMac1963 wrote:
DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE wrote:He was elected on this promise BY THE PEOPLE....There is nothing wrong with him fulfilling his promises that he was elected for.


Don't forget half the eligible voter did not vote, and he actually lost the popular vote by the largest of and electoral collage/popular vote flip. It easy for us to get bound up in our own little political world and brush these folks off as snowflakes, tree huggers, feminazies and such. We have to live with these people as one nation. Right now it pretty much getting pulled into 2. Mainly because were screaming so loud we can't hear each other. Neither side is right, or perfect. We better settle or beef and get our united act together before someone comes along and eats our lunch for us.


Ray --

Here's the problem with that line of thinking. When obama was in charge, I didn't hear anyone on the left saying they needed to remember that there were people who don't agree with them. I do recall obama saying republicans could ride in the back of the bus. I do recall o-care being pushed through with all kinds of machinations and without a single republican vote. I do recall harry reid abandoning the filibuster rule.

So, we on the right are supposed to be considerate, play nice, uphold the filibuster, etc etc, when those on the left ignore all those things and push full steam ahead on their agenda.

President Trump is the first person in years--decades, even--who has provided any pushback on the liberal democrat nightmare. I say, Godspeed, President Trump!



Ray---I hear you on keeping eyes open....I voted Trump because I care about the country and think it's a spit in the face of every veteran that ever fought or died in the line of duty if someone didn't vote at all. Yes, we have the right to not vote as well but that's just plain stupid.

I didn't go in this with blinders on....Trump is FAR from perfect but he was running on a lot of policies I agree with what we need to start correcting our countries losses thus far. Trade, immigration, taxes, and the the same old corrupt politician.

Hillary is just PLAIN EVIL no matter how someone tries to spin her so he was the logical choice on election day as no other had even a chance Vs. her....
A prime example of Trumps failings is how he released the ban(but there was no winning way to do it for everyone's opinions) and even worse was his comment today on the Federal judges ruling for stay....THAT is the entire reason we have separation of powers... So no one man may become dictator.....This will work itself out in the system we have. It's going to be a bloody fight, but it will be "Come what may".

Trump was the obvious choice trusting in our system to offer checks and balances against any single branch of government.....And Anita's correct too, I wish him Godspeed....How could anyone not? HE'S OUR PRESIDENT!!! If you wish him failure, you wish your country and ALL of us failure...HOW STUPID IS THAT???

The votes over....It doesn't matter by what margin or if a bunch of dumbasses didn't vote because they didn't like anyone or didn't care....Those people can cry all they want but have NO ONE to blame but themselves and need to just STFU. I'm sure they're mostly good people but STFU already....

He was elected by the people fairly in our system established....It's EXACTLY why it was built that way to begin with.(Electoral College)....The country chose and it was decided.

As I told you and agree with you earlier, My eyes are wide open...no blinders. As of now, he's done nothing wrong IMO...Is he crass? Is he an authoritative person? of course! That's who was elected....


And mollypup has very valid points above as well.....I don't see it getting better before worse though. I sincerely hope we can find a common ground because we're all dead if we don't. NOBODY wins in a civil war and that's where its headed if this crap just grows ............ THIS.IS.WHY.WE.PREP.....amongst other reasons.

I'll be watching and supporting him 100% UNLESS I see something heinous...very unlikely. Again, IMO.

My $.02....I'm done.
Preparation through education is less costly than learning through tragedy.
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If I had eight hours to chop down a tree, I'd spend six sharpening my axe.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby RayMac1963 » Sun Feb 05, 2017 9:07 am

daaswampman wrote:You could argue the number of votes, but what differences does it make now? It is also just silly to think, that everyone who didn't vote would have voted for Clinton. I know people who did not vote, because they did not believe he could win. A fact that the media constantly reported.
Swamp


Swamp, I'm not saying they would have voted for her. It isn't even about party. The problem/question is WHY didn't they vote at all. What the heck is going on where so many people are in the IDGAF category that voter participation has fallen so low. The "system" is not reaching them, or working for them, or something... How many times have people given their lives for all us to have the right to vote? The 15 amendment, 19 amendment, voting rights act of 1965, are all written with blood. Even 26 amendment changing the age to vote to match the draft was a fight, and all that was AFTER 1776. So why don't people care anymore? If our leaders have a duty to at least think about all the citizens whether they voted or not is a whole different question.
I can't help but think God is up there right now saying "its time to shake the ol' Etch-A-Sketch and restart humanity again".



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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby rickdun » Sun Feb 05, 2017 9:20 am

Ray, I believe that people don't vote is because of politics. What I mean is who ever the elected office is, mayor of a small town, state representative/senator, federal congressman/senator or even a president, will not fight for the one's that put them in office, they fight each other, republican agains democrat.

Look at chuck shumur, he's not going to vote for the next justice, but he voted for him before (current position), as I said it's republican against democrate and not what's good for the american people/country. And people are just sick and tired of it.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby anita » Sun Feb 05, 2017 1:31 pm

RayMac1963 wrote:[

Swamp, I'm not saying they would have voted for her. It isn't even about party. The problem/question is WHY didn't they vote at all. What the heck is going on where so many people are in the IDGAF category that voter participation has fallen so low. The "system" is not reaching them, or working for them, or something... How many times have people given their lives for all us to have the right to vote? The 15 amendment, 19 amendment, voting rights act of 1965, are all written with blood. Even 26 amendment changing the age to vote to match the draft was a fight, and all that was AFTER 1776. So why don't people care anymore? If our leaders have a duty to at least think about all the citizens whether they voted or not is a whole different question.


I think it's the schools, Ray. Civics is no longer taught. The military is not held up in respect. The flag isn't, the country isn't. I think kids barely have an idea of the three branches of government.

It's not just kids either. Do you ever watch those man-on-the-street questions? Holding up a photo of biden or ginsberg or Antonin Scalia. They have NO CLUE. But hold up a photo of miley cyrus or beyonce, and everyone recognizes them. Ask them a simple question--like who was president during the civil war--few can come up with Lincoln. Who was our first president? -- Crickets.

i don't know what your schools are like out there, but my son goes to a prep school and if it weren't his last year, it would be his last year anyway. I can't take it any more. I cannot believe I am paying good money for him to have his head filled with out-and-out garbage. Teachers crying in the classrooms the day after the election, saying Trump was going to have internment camps. Kids running around with rainbow flags wrapped around themselves (even though it's not part of the uniform--yet!) Teachers sneaking anti-conservative, anti-Trump rhetoric into tests and assignments. One teacher came into class last Monday and said she couldn't grade papers because she was too distraught after watching all the protesting. Not that she was protesting, mind you, just that the protests distressed her so much that she couldn't function.

My older kids went to that same school during 9/11, and there was no crying in the classrooms by the teachers, no yelping and wailing--even though many families knew people who were in NYC that day, and some had relatives who died. Things have really changed in 15 years, and not for the better.

Fortunately my youngest has his head on straight (he wears his WWRD--What Would Reagan Do? tee-shirt when he can get away with it. I had to buy him a new one because the last one wore out.) So none of the crap at school influences him. He's become pretty articulate at stating and defending his positions. And the conservatives at school are seen as the rebels, so he likes that. He can be a rebel by not being a crazy loon.

They'll be out at the next election though, with about 5 million of their dead and illegal friends if we don't get voter fraud under control.

But going to school meetings and hearing the lockstep dogma (crap) being repeated over and over is chilling. I don't think there is any way to get through to these knuckleheads without hitting rock bottom. Total collapse. I hope it doesn't happen, but it's either that or civil war, I fear.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby Mollypup » Sun Feb 05, 2017 4:07 pm

I think think the people who don't give a crap about voting don't give a crap because 1. they're somewhat clueless as to how the system actually works (think it's meant to give them whatever they want & when it doesn't are disillusioned ) 2. they do understand how the system works & have come to the conclusion that the govt is so corrupt & broken run by politicians so corrupt that there is simply little point when they do as they wish anyway. Sort of difficult to muster up the enthusiasm & energy to go to the voting booth. Neither of these are good as it does indeed show how corrupt & broken our system has become. It no longer works for the People. It works for itself. Which is, in all honesty, perfectly understandable. What is the motivation to continuing to participate in a process that your participation has no effect on?

I still vote, but I now refuse to do "damage control" mainly because in recent years this is basically impossible except perhaps in local elections. I refuse to accept tinkle poor candidates simply because that is all either party is willing to put onto the ballot. Do repeatedly do so only makes the situation worse, not better. There is no such thing as damage control in politics. If you choose a substandard candidate with that in mind, then the parties view that level of competence acceptable by the people and just keep shoving it at you (or pick worse ones) I think that has contributed significantly to the level of both corruption & incompetence we see in govt of all levels now.

anita, had teachers in my kids classrooms behaved like that........there would be consequences. I'd have the superintendent by the ear demanding any teacher unable to perform duties for such a ridiculous reason be placed on administrative leave or fired for incompetence. Nor would I be alone. If that wasn't enough, I'd pull the state school board into it. But then our school district doesn't mess with me.......and tend to start hiding when they see me coming, even though it's now my grandchildren in those classrooms. lol Heck, I'll do it if I so much as hear about it from my grandkids. I've done it before many times (didn't work out well for the district, nearly had them shut down permanently) and I'll do it again in a heartbeat. I don't put up with crap like that nor do I run from it. Our funds pay for our kids education (private or public), those people work for US. No sense in such ridiculous behavior.

However, if you do yank him out consider ECOT online public schooling available in every state. Excellent rating by me. Youngest graduated with her average pulled from barely passing to honor roll. (different set of circumstances than your issue made me go that route with her)

Forum editor changed my word " p i s s " to "tinkle" :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: best laugh I've had all day
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby daaswampman » Sun Feb 05, 2017 7:20 pm

RayMac1963 wrote:
daaswampman wrote:You could argue the number of votes, but what differences does it make now? It is also just silly to think, that everyone who didn't vote would have voted for Clinton. I know people who did not vote, because they did not believe he could win. A fact that the media constantly reported.
Swamp


Swamp, I'm not saying they would have voted for her. It isn't even about party. The problem/question is WHY didn't they vote at all. What the heck is going on where so many people are in the IDGAF category that voter participation has fallen so low. The "system" is not reaching them, or working for them, or something... How many times have people given their lives for all us to have the right to vote? The 15 amendment, 19 amendment, voting rights act of 1965, are all written with blood. Even 26 amendment changing the age to vote to match the draft was a fight, and all that was AFTER 1776. So why don't people care anymore? If our leaders have a duty to at least think about all the citizens whether they voted or not is a whole different question.


I vote as I consider it a duty, but don't believe it matters except in local elections. Nor do I believe it will matter, until we eliminate career politicians and political parties. Apathy - yes, unrealistic - not a chance. Without insider influence and money, nobody has a chance in our current system. That is why I don't believe we just elected a real outsider. There are no "accidents" in American politics. Swamp
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby anita » Sun Feb 05, 2017 8:02 pm

Mollypup wrote:anita, had teachers in my kids classrooms behaved like that........there would be consequences. I'd have the superintendent by the ear demanding any teacher unable to perform duties for such a ridiculous reason be placed on administrative leave or fired for incompetence. Nor would I be alone. If that wasn't enough, I'd pull the state school board into it. But then our school district doesn't mess with me.......and tend to start hiding when they see me coming, even though it's now my grandchildren in those classrooms. lol Heck, I'll do it if I so much as hear about it from my grandkids. I've done it before many times (didn't work out well for the district, nearly had them shut down permanently) and I'll do it again in a heartbeat. I don't put up with crap like that nor do I run from it. Our funds pay for our kids education (private or public), those people work for US. No sense in such ridiculous behavior.

However, if you do yank him out consider ECOT online public schooling available in every state. Excellent rating by me. Youngest graduated with her average pulled from barely passing to honor roll. (different set of circumstances than your issue made me go that route with her)

Forum editor changed my word " p i s s " to "tinkle" :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: best laugh I've had all day


Molly, As I mentioned, this is a private prep school There is no school district to deal with. I have complained, others have gone to the board of trustees. It doesn't make any difference. The only thing that will make a difference is when parents start pulling their kids. A couple did last year. More will likely do it this year. When the donations and tuitions dry up, then they might get rid of the current administrators--who are relatively new with a liberal agenda. I don't need to hear "tough talk". I've done plenty over my many, MANY, years with schools. (Since my kids spread a 12 year span between the oldest and youngest, I've had kids in schools for about 25 years.)

This is my youngest's last year in high school, thank goodness. As I said, if it weren't, it would be his last year at this school. Right now I'm just trying to get out of there.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby Nyx_Chaos » Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:12 am

daaswampman wrote:You joined today, just to post a long winded rant about politics? Swamp


Well,no but I'm just that kind of person that can debate poltics and such 24/7 :lol:
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby ajax727 » Mon Feb 06, 2017 10:07 am

NYX-
Your point of view is slanted or rant is slanted . Your rant as you said are not left or right nor repub or dem . Your rant seems to be left bring them all into the USA no matter if they have an agenda to kill Americans or not .
If you truly believe they are all safe and mean us no harm , then open your home to them open your land if you are a land owner to them to live on your property , you pay all there bills and not expect us as tax payers to support them .
The ban is a win for Trump if no terrorist attacks us then he can say see the ban works if we are attacked then he can say see they the left stopped the ban an Americans are now dead .
One idea you should take a trip to one of the banned countries , proclaim you are an American wave the flag . I will light a candle for you after you are beheaded or burnt alive . We will not buy you back unless you are worth the 100 million dollar price placed upon your head that is the going rate placed upon us by our past president .
Present facts not opinions for a debate you will find people here use facts for a response .
To see things as they are not as they want you to see them .. With the stroke of a pen all you rights and freedom can end ...
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby Defcon09 » Mon Feb 06, 2017 5:41 pm

Blondie wrote:I read thru the newly imposed immigration ban and I was surprised to learn that it included those who already have a Green Card or visa.

While the protests at JFK are a "meh" for me, I came zcross this response to an article on the topic on ZH. While those of us who read ZH know the responses can run amok, this one caught my eye:

Trump is waiting for more updates on the Israeli intelligence he received warning of an imminent attack on the United States by a Saudi sponsored group of mercenaries. This immigration gate closure was planned but was rushed through after Trump found out that the terrorists were on the move. Unlike 9/11, Israel this time let the USA know of the attack plans, knowing full well that if Trump found out later that Israel failed to warn the USA, there would be hell to pay. The question for me is, was the Super Bowl the target, just like in the move "Black Sunday".

In light of the fact that DJT has spoken with Bibi and it's been real silent for my tastes, care to comment?


I didn't want to get involved in this topic. Seems it got a minor side track on schools and teachers. However, Trumps so called ban is temporary believe it or not. Unless there is some sort of attack which can be connected to immigrants. AND, the hiatas is not illegal. Read this:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/02/ ... n-ban.html

The President Has Authority to Dictate Immigration
Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution gives Congress the power to regulate immigration. In 1952, Congress passed a law empowering the president to deny entry into the U.S. to “any class of aliens” considered to be “detrimental to the interests of the United States.”  In other words, a threat to America and in the interests of national security.   
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby RayMac1963 » Mon Feb 06, 2017 8:27 pm

I think what bothers me most about it is I feel like its a ready, fire, aim, move. What good is a temp ban, if the real problem is we need better investigative processes and an integrated background system to vet through. Even worse, were going to stop these people(for a while as Defcon pointed out) but let Saudis just come walking in? Its the Saudi equivalent of snowflakes that pulled off 911, and were the original leadership for these terrorist groups. The ban sounds nice, but its not dealing with the real problem because we like their light sweet crude. And what about enemies who have bounced through two and three European countries first and season themselves, then come here. These are homegrown and seasoned combatants hitting euro cities.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby Blondie » Wed Feb 08, 2017 1:08 am

The law is on DJT's side. The US can restrict immigration from any country it chooses. For as long as we choose to do so. We do this every year when the US announces their quotas. I did realize that yes, this is temporary ban.

That said, I listened to most of the arguments presented to the 9th Circuit Appeals Court. The justices tore up the sad sack attorneys. We will have a decision on the appeal shortly. Perhaps as early as Friday.

The hearing was about an hour. It's out on ZH if anyone wants to listen.
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Re: Newly Imposed Immigration Ban

Postby KazKaz » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:16 am

I think the most important details of the ban have been downplayed into the fog of oblivion.
Green card and visa holders being included is a huge indication of just how imminent the danger truly is.
The ban translates to Trump believing that the vetting process in place for the past couple years is completely ineffective.
Translation: the bad guys got an open invitation.
In the last month of the Obama administration, Guantanamo released the organizers and leaders of these unvetted asylum seekers. That doesnt even include those who bought their way past the process to use sound finances in seeking domestic business opportunities and college educations..
The past administration encouraged an environment of tolerance as they used the border as their personal toll booth, with little regard for the liability of that reckless greed.
For 2 decades now, we have been poking a stick in a hornets nest halfway around the world under the false pretense of calling it a 'war on terror'.
Trump knows the hive is swarming.
He is trying to mitigate the threat by disrupting the organizations that are ALREADY IN THE COUNTRY PLOTTING.
If Hillary was elected? We would be on our way to a civil war. The war on terror would be in our back yards in no time.
Nothing is going to stop the ticking clock on the inevitable in regards to extremist Muslims and their agenda for domination.
Stomp your feet in a mud puddle and it spreads. Always.
Trump is doing everything in his power to keep the threat halfway around the globe.
I'm truly amazed by the number of people who can't follow the dots and realize that there is a huge difference between Muslims and Radical Muslims.
They are not the same. Not even close.
So, let's bring this into perspective.
Christianity? If people wish to bow their heads at a restaurant and give thanks for their meal, great. Good for them. Faith is healthy.
If those same people walk to every other table in the establishment and demand that every person under that roof joins them in prayer for a solid hour before eating?
Well, somebody is gonna get stabbed with a fork, right?
There's the difference.
So, if anybody wants to call Trump racist or homophobic?! They should feel free to put the entire family on a plane and share a cave in Afghanistan for a weekend with a gang of extremist Muslims.
Might as well try it before you buy it.
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